Resource Cap Points Change

Hi all,

As you're all probably aware, some time ago Jagex released a large-scale clan update which targeted a lot of features (including resource caps) for quality of life improvements. One of the main improvements made was a drastic reduction in the time it takes to cap at the citadel, and the introduction of the 50% plot boost, along with the boost when capping with other clan mates.

Due to this reduction in time invested, staff and I have decided to adjust the points for resource cap + citadel cap related events to the following:

• Resource Cap is now worth 30 points
  
• Citadel Cap Party (Weekly) is now worth 20 points
  

I have decided to make this change at the beginning of an 'Activity' week for us, which I know is off-cycle for the build tick. I hope you all can understand the reasons behind this change, one of the main ones being that we base our activity points off time invested, and we believe that these new values accurately reflect the time investment a little better than a blanket 40/40 would.

Open to feedback or comments on this should it be needed. Happy to discuss if there are any questions.

This change is effective now.

Thanks!

Makes sense. Thanks for the update with explanation.

While I understand the change, I do not like it. Not one bit. Not speaking for others and for me specifically it affects the way I possibly rank up because I do not play as much as I used to or can, I am mainly limited to citadel caps and posting as a way to earn points because of the times I am able to get on to play, and now that is cut down to make it an even slower process for something that was out of my hands. One argument is that rank ups do not matter, and this is the camp that I usually fall in, but at the same time if that is the case, then why change the points at all if it doesn't.

I do not think a more efficient citadel capping should affect how effort towards contributing to the clan should matter and this sets a slippery slope of a precedent. As skills inevitably are getting faster and faster to train, should that start to affect how skill competitions work? Should events start to be longer to count? Etc etc..

While I understand the change, I do not like it. Not one bit. Not speaking for others and for me specifically it affects the way I possibly rank up because I do not play as much as I used to or can, I am mainly limited to citadel caps and posting as a way to earn points because of the times I am able to get on to play, and now that is cut down to make it an even slower process for something that was out of my hands. One argument is that rank ups do not matter, and this is the camp that I usually fall in, but at the same time if that is the case, then why change the points at all if it doesn't.

I do not think a more efficient citadel capping should affect how effort towards contributing to the clan should matter and this sets a slippery slope of a precedent. As skills inevitably are getting faster and faster to train, should that start to affect how skill competitions work? Should events start to be longer to count? Etc etc..

It's not an easy decision to make, and it's not one that I take lightly either. Ranks are a very touchy subject, and no, my main thought is not changing the mechanics of this every day, but in a similar vein, if suddenly Jagex made Penguin hunting 50-70% faster in an update, we'd probably have to review the points for this as well. I don't want there to be an 'optimal method' to rank up, I just want people to enjoy participating and get rewarded for it as a result (naturally!)

To put things into context, before the changes, if a member capped every week at the weekly citadel event (25 minutes per week) for a year straight, on this alone would be half way to our highest rank. If we want ranking up to mean something, it has to be balanced.

I am fully aware that changing this has implications beyond the regular member who has more play time available. However we've had other positive initiatives to assist with these kinds of situations while also encouraging general social activity, such as introducing a forum post bonus of 10 points, then doubling it to 20 and keeping it there, for every 10 posts. (This was not a thing a couple of months ago at all)

We're also looking into other options to measure activity beyond events and posts (potentially Discord activity via Surreal Bot) - a traditional clan will just measure a member's worth by whether or not they cap in the citadel, and I feel capping, while helpful, is not why we recruit clan members. We are more than a citadel, and you shouldn't have to rely on it to receive points. We recruit clan members so that you can enjoy and have fun in-game through events and competitions, or make great friends in our Discord / clan chat.

So since you have mentioned timing being an off factor for you, maybe we can chat via PM about your situation and work something out events-wise or take some suggestions for more positive change within the clan?

Thanks for commenting your honest feedback, I do appreciate it.

Cool! Still takes me 45 minutes to cap...

Makes sense to me.

I'm fine with this. I like capping every week so don't even think about the points I get. I do the capping for the good (and free) xp we get from it.

My 2 cents being a new guy here....the whole citadel/avatar/rank system has changed. Not just amount of time it takes to cap. Not trying to diminish anything, but now that a clan avatar is based on fealty vs clan rank, what does a clan rank mean anyway? But if you would prefer clan ranks based on time in game, then add that to the requirements, don't reduce the reward because you want more longevity. One can still receive all the benefits of the avatar bonus, and never actually cap. I would like to think, the 40 points is worth it to the leadership to ensure the clan gets the rss needed for upkeep and upgrades. Since cutting the point reward in half, I, may as well just maintain fealty rank and not spend the entire time needed to cap, and I could continue to use my more limited gameplay time more towards my goals. FWIW

My 2 cents being a new guy here....the whole citadel/avatar/rank system has changed. Not just amount of time it takes to cap. Not trying to diminish anything, but now that a clan avatar is based on fealty vs clan rank, what does a clan rank mean anyway? But if you would prefer clan ranks based on time in game, then add that to the requirements, don't reduce the reward because you want more longevity. One can still receive all the benefits of the avatar bonus, and never actually cap. I would like to think, the 40 points is worth it to the leadership to ensure the clan gets the rss needed for upkeep and upgrades. Since cutting the point reward in half, I, may as well just maintain fealty rank and not spend the entire time needed to cap, and I could continue to use my more limited gameplay time more towards my goals. FWIW

Yes, it has changed entirely - we can view data of who is at what fealty rank as well, so maybe that needs to be explored instead of capping. Ranking up in the clan has never and will never be representative of how many times you cap in the citadel - since 2011 our points have been modelled around roughly how much time an event will take, to try and reward you for time spent at an event.

If we count all events as exactly equal, when they are not, I feel that is not right when considering the system we have. If anyone has a read of the mission statement of this clan, you will not and should never see "we want our members to cap the citadel and that's all" in there - the goal is to have fun, so if capping the citadel is not something you particularly enjoy, I am not comfortable with the idea that people feel obliged to do it, even though they do not want to.

My 2 cents being a new guy here....the whole citadel/avatar/rank system has changed. Not just amount of time it takes to cap. Not trying to diminish anything, but now that a clan avatar is based on fealty vs clan rank, what does a clan rank mean anyway? But if you would prefer clan ranks based on time in game, then add that to the requirements, don't reduce the reward because you want more longevity. One can still receive all the benefits of the avatar bonus, and never actually cap. I would like to think, the 40 points is worth it to the leadership to ensure the clan gets the rss needed for upkeep and upgrades. Since cutting the point reward in half, I, may as well just maintain fealty rank and not spend the entire time needed to cap, and I could continue to use my more limited gameplay time more towards my goals. FWIW

Yes, it has changed entirely - we can view data of who is at what fealty rank as well, so maybe that needs to be explored instead of capping. Ranking up in the clan has never and will never be representative of how many times you cap in the citadel - since 2011 our points have been modelled around roughly how much time an event will take, to try and reward you for time spent at an event.

If we count all events as exactly equal, when they are not, I feel that is not right when considering the system we have. If anyone has a read of the mission statement of this clan, you will not and should never see "we want our members to cap the citadel and that's all" in there - the goal is to have fun, so if capping the citadel is not something you particularly enjoy, I am not comfortable with the idea that people feel obliged to do it, even though they do not want to.

Right. And just to add on. Capping at the citadel isn't really a community event. It benefits the person capping/getting fealty more than it does the clan - typically as seeing a 6% bonus to everything is wonderful. Now the citadel party on Friday is more of an opportunity to get the capping done even quicker as there is some sort of bonus for having more clannies there, but again it's a benefit to getting to be with your mates and have fun doing more than just capping. I don't think all clan events are created equal and considering the activity level in this clan simply requires you to show up every so often or post on the forums from time to time I don't think the clan is worried about which events you show up to - particularly capping - and more about the enjoyment of your RS playing. Plus, I don't think many people think/care about their clan rank.