Legacy Mode: The Who

I would rather have those people than someone who thinks its their business to tell others how they must spend their time and money. There are a whole lot of snobs on every side who think their way is the only way, who will blast anyone who sees it another way, and who just can't let it go. We'd all be better off if everyone would agree to disagree. This kind of stubbornness and hostility hurts everyone more than a video game update that some people won't use.

To extend your restaurant analogy, you're a patron who really likes the new menu, and you're mad at me for coming back because the restaurant also started serving my favorite sandwich again. Don't you think that's kind of silly?

Wow, well someone's a bit mad. You clearly don't understand what I mean and I get that I may not have been as explicit as may have been possible, but here, let me try again.

You don't have to like the new stuff. In fact, go ahead and leave if you don't like it because, you're correct, you have no reason to stay if the one dish you love is the only reason you were there. But for many people, combat wasn't the whole game, including most of this clan. Additionally, it's not those that simply leave the restaurant after giving it a few tries that I am accusing of negatively impacting the community, it's those that stand outside the goddamned restaurant day after bloomin' day and yell for the owners to "give it back", "we pay, we say", and refuse to respect the authority and decision-making of the owners.

Maybe you're one of those people, maybe you're not, and I am more than willing to admit that there are exceptions to my generalization, but when so much of the community that got their panties in a wad because of the EOC is returning and STILL causing an uproar that their combat system is no longer supreme and it isn't exactly the same as before, it's hard to ignore the fact that this could end up being a detriment to the community simply because a vocal minority decides to ruin everything.

As I said, I know people who preferred the old stuff, but didn't create an absolute shitstorm because something they enjoyed was gone.

Change happens. Move on.

"That's life." - Frank Sinatra

If I understand your posts correctly you're arguing that the legacy update is going to bring players that will create hostility within the game. I think the whole point of the beta is for players to complain so that Jagex understand strengths and weaknesses of the legacy update which is what you're also doing creating this post.
I've tried the Legacy beta for about 10 minutes and didn't like it and I think it's weird that there's two different combat systems going on at once but hey, there's only benefits because if I want to use special attacks or want to afk like the old days then now it's available to me.

If I understand your posts correctly you're arguing that the legacy update is going to bring players that will create hostility within the game. I think the whole point of the beta is for players to complain so that Jagex understand strengths and weaknesses of the legacy update which is what you're also doing creating this post.
I've tried the Legacy beta for about 10 minutes and didn't like it and I think it's weird that there's two different combat systems going on at once but hey, there's only benefits because if I want to use special attacks or want to afk like the old days then now it's available to me.

My primary concern, Jerome, is not with the system itself, it is first and foremost a concern that those that Jagex are looking to appeal to are primarily those that are unsatisfiable. They never stop taking.

For example, for those that know their world history somewhat, remember what happened between Chamberlain and Hitler right before the invasion of Poland? Hitler agreed with Chamberlain that he could have what he had already claimed as his, as long as he didn't try and take over more stuff. Happy times, yes? Again, no. Hitler ignores his pact with Chamberlain and invades Poland, and continues on his merry way.

Now that the Nazi/EOC-hater metaphor is done, I do want to say that clearly the situation is not exactly the same, and Hitler is not the equivalent to the vocal minority of the community, but what Chamberlain tried to do is very much what I see Jagex doing. This is APPEASEMENT.

Once a lot of these people have Legacy, do you really think they'll stop there? Do you really think they'll learn to accept those that choose to pk with EOC mechanics?

I may very well be proven wrong, but previous experience would suggest that those that I refer to are not going to be happy until everthing is just the way they want it, which would in turn ruin the experience for those that either like the combat system, or don't really care about combat yet would prefer to have this valuable dev time being put forth to better the game and advance it, rather than dwell on trying to make everyone happy with combat.

The more I've read this topic the more I find myself leaning towards what Dave has been saying.

From my own perspective I can never see away from the fact that the basis behind your post is all about the people that play RS / used to play RS and the "community". I've been playing RS myself longer than you (2002) and over that time the changes and way I've played the game has been so different. Do I regret any of the changes? No, I just adapt to them into how I play the game. Have any changes ever effected my RS experience for the worse? No, thats pretty self obvious in that I'm still here actively playing.

Over the years I've gone from being a quester / skiller until in 2006 and I hit 126 cmb I ventured into the side (you seem to dislike and say they're bad) of the pking world. Yeah, there were people that would give the "complainers" a bad reputation. It doesn't mean that everyone was like that. My best pking clan experience was in 08/09 and when the leaders decided to close the clan when we were near the top of the pking world I was furious as I loved the community we had in the clan and it was going. The leaders had said it was down to the pking world changing & at the time I couldn't see that. Looking back I see now they made the right decision and the pking world changed. It still didn't stop me from enjoying my RS time.

When 07scape came out last year I went and played that more actively than EOC as I was one of those that wasn't an amazing fan of EOC and it took me back, yet never replaced, my experiences from 2007 the first time around. I came back to EOC just before Div was released as I knew that should I return I'd need it at 99 for my comp cape.

I enjoy EOC now as much as I enjoyed classic back in 2003 and then RS2 when that came out. Things change and people adapt. It only effects you if you let it. You don't have to speak to these "bad people" that you say are gonna be returning because of Legacy. Legacy is just another change in RS like many that have gone on before. I've not yet tried the beta, I'll just see what happens, but I know that it certainly won't change me as a person or the network of friends that I have and the friendships that I've made over the years. As far as I see it you only let people effect you yourself. There's an ignore button to use on them if you need to or you can just chose to be mature and not let their complaining and whining get to you. Something that sadly appears to be doing here with yourself.

The world is never gonna be one big happy place of love and happiness, its just how you chose yourself to let it effect you as to how you deal with it. And to get so serious over a thing like a combat update on a game in which you're part of a skilling clan, I (sorry to be frank) see it as pretty pointless.

My primary concern, Jerome, is not with the system itself, it is first and foremost a concern that those that Jagex are looking to appeal to are primarily those that are unsatisfiable. They never stop taking.

Jagex is looking to appeal to as many people as possible, some of which will be the type you describe. That's not reason enough to scrap the update. If Legacy Mode brings in more players or gives them something they would like to have, then it's good for the game. Your concerns about intangible harm to the community don't hold a candle to the actual benefits of adding a feature that people want and bringing more people to the game.

Once a lot of these people have Legacy, do you really think they'll stop there? Do you really think they'll learn to accept those that choose to pk with EOC mechanics?

That's an entirely different problem that already exists in the pking community, which you can observe if you try to pk someone with a protection prayer, eat food to stay at full health, or teleport when you're about to lose. Those aren't real rules, they're just unwritten rules someone made up, and it's my opinion that anyone who insists you do it their way can go jump in a lake. But that's still not enough to throw an otherwise good update out the window.

It is really cool, this Legacy thingy. Feels good to look back how this game used to be and it is nice that they give the oppoturnity to try it again.

But Jagex tries a little bit too hard with pleasing everybody. Right now community is torn into 2(RS3 and OSRS), if they launch Legacy servers it will be torn into 3 sides. So what´s next? More gametypes? I don´t know if it is right whay they do, but my opinion is they try to like to everybody and you never can do that.

And to get so serious over a thing like a combat update on a game in which you're part of a skilling clan, I (sorry to be frank) see it as pretty pointless.

This goes far beyond combat. It's a community issue, which is part of what this clan promotes. You say that I can either choose to let them influence me or not, which I understand, frankly, I've learned to drown out all the white noise like much of those who have played for a while have learned to do but again I'll say that the concern is not for me, nor is it for you people, it's for the future of the game as a whole. New players who may like the EOC combat system being degraded for their choices, a seemingly split community.... How is this good for the FUTURE. I don't care about here in the now. I could quit tomorrow and it wouldn't change a thing, but my only worry is for down the road.

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I'm done replying to people. Some people can cope with change, others can't. I'd rather play with those that can adapt, but if you prefer otherwise, power to you.

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Admittedly, I overreacted and overgeneralized. I'm just sad to see Jagex failing to stand up for what they once advertised as a good update. I want to believe in the game I play, but it's hard to do when the players' shouting has as much of an impact as the right mind of a content developer.

I may very well be proven wrong, but previous experience would suggest that those that I refer to are not going to be happy until everthing is just the way they want it, which would in turn ruin the experience for those that either like the combat system, or don't really care about combat yet would prefer to have this valuable dev time being put forth to better the game and advance it, rather than dwell on trying to make everyone happy with combat.

I think that the Legacy update is valuable development time being put forth to better the game and advance it. The whole point of updates is to bring the players something new to enjoy and this huge upcoming update will be just that. No one really loses either since there's both EOC and preEOC combat. If you're arguing that this update is bad for the game in the long run then those issues should be dealt with then; I don't foresee any problems the Legacy update will cause that don't already exist. I mean, there's barely any real community within the game that's not made up by teams, clans, etc. because the worlds aren't crowded anymore; the game's practically dead compared to a couple of years back. This update may bring back a good community rather than ruin one that barely exists.